confused by flaker

Alright, bare with me because this was posted on another forum, and i decided to post it here for better advice:

ok women confuse the hell out of me, here is my situation (sorry its a bit long, but its worth it):

i met this chick last week (wednesday night) at a dance club. we danced, had good convo for how loud it was in there, and i got her to bounce to other locations with me. I was playing it off casual and non-needy, so she asks for my number which shows some strong intrest. by the end of the night she was calling me badass and everything. things went perfect because i kept running into aquaintances throughout the night so it looked like i was popular. i didnt kiss her that night because she was with her friend the whole time. so she tells me she wants to hang out this weekend. i tell her ok i will call u, and we hug (a big hug) and then part ways

so the weekend rolls around, i call her and we go out saturday night. again she brings the friend. we have excellent convo, she gives IOI's, we bounce to a club. at the club we dance very close and im able to isolate her and finally plant the kiss. we made out a lot the whole night and she even lets her friend leave with another guy which shows she trusts me. At the end of the night, when we get to my car, she tells me she really wants to set something up - just the two of us. so i tell her i find out my work schedule tomorrow (sunday) and i will call her. she says ok and seems happy with that

we had a great time both nights, good convo, good kissing, much attraction between us. So i call her sunday night, no answer. I called her again monday and left a simple message like "give me a call back so we can set something up this week". Looking back, calling again on monday may have been a mistake, but she REALLY showed intrest in me saturday night. Its now thursday and i havent heard from her, but have i called again. WTF?????

this really hurt my self confidence, but how could it be me? The only things i can think of why shes doing this are:
1) i made the mistake of telling her friend im going back to school in the fall and maybe the friend told her that. this could make the target feel like its not worth going any further... My school is only 1.5 hours away tho

2) there is something mentally wrong with her (lol)

So what should i do? what should i say if she does call me back (which i doubt). i dont have text messaging, and she knows this. im totally confused, help!

thanks

now here is what Rye Lee posted...which was very good advice:

Honestly what I'd recommend, is giving her a call from a different phone, now that it has been a few days. This enables you to do a few things; you can get an idea of whether she's screening you so that you stop being paranoid about it, cause that's probably part of what you're thinking right now, you can talk to her if she is screening you and by connecting with her again you'll overpower any silly reasons she may have had, you talk to her and reconnect in case she had just gotten busy and forgotten to call you back (this does happen to all sorts of people all the time). If she doesn't answer, then don't leave a message, just give her a call again later, unless she isn't worth trying to get a hold of.

Now, in the future, I'd recommend you stay away from leaving the simple message that tells her to call you back. You can totally HINT to a girl that she should call you back, but don't outright tell her unless you've got really good rapport built, because it tends to get a lot of girls that aren't into "being told what to do" irked (yeah, this IS a stupid girl thing). In this case I would have said something like, "Hey, I just called to let you know I got my schedule for work. I'm pretty busy, but we can probably get together sometime later this week." Now she knows you've got the info you guys were waiting for in order to make plans and she knows you're busy (DHV), but you're interested in finding some time later in the week to hang out. She's more likely to call you back now, cause she's got an idea what's up, but you didn't get right to business and you left enough mystery that she's curious and is gonna want to get answers to any questions she has, like when and where.

ok here is me again

ok so i decided to just call her. she answers and says "hello?" so i say "hello" and shes like "can i help you.....?" LOL

so i said yes you can help me and told her who i was. she seemed excited like "oh hiii!!" but it couldve been fake. She then told me she was on the phone with her boss and she would call me back. so i paused for a second then said "are you really gonna call me back?" (tone of my voice was kinda like 'if ur bullshitting, just tell me and we can be done with this') but she said yes. i was trying to see if she was bullshitting. if she was, all i need is for her to tell me what the problem is so i can move on and stop doubting myself

we'll see if she calls me back

then 30 minutes later i posted:

ok, a half an hour later and she hasnt called me back. its over (what a psycho)

thanks for the advice tho!

friday night i posted

GUESS WHAT

i ran into her tonite (friday) at the bars.

i honestly didnt care at this point, so i just said "so what was it...?" and she says "what??" so i say "what was it that made u not call me?" i was being AFC at this time because i had already made up my mind i was done with her, so it didnt matter. all i wanted to know was what she didnt like about me. so she goes into this story about being forgetful and having a stressful week. i wasnt having it, and she could tell. somehow she clinged to me after that. i went bar hopping with her tonite just for the hell of it. we danced and made out a lot. it seemed like the more i pushed away from her, the more she came. A few times i said "i hate you" with a smirk; that really drawed her in. She said she wants to hang out sunday. i'll take it with a grain of salt. i already told myself im done with her, so its not a big deal if she flakes on me again. I have absolutely no trust in her.

I also got in with the best guy friend of hers. he told me all about her, about how shes always on the move and it takes a lot to hold her attention. he also told me im better than any other guy shes been with, and i got his approval. They have been really good friends for 5 years and he is in his late 30's so nothing to worry about there (as far as him wanting her).

we will see if this psycho calls me . She did have a very guilty attitude the whole night...


UPDATE:
ok well she didnt call me sunday, but i did not call her either. maybe she wanted me to call her so she knows im still interested. to be honest, i didnt want to call her sunday just in spite of her and the crap she tried to put me thru. i dont know if she did it on purpose, but it would be hard to do all that on accident. Should i call her? What if she doesnt answer?

I personally wouldn't call her for about a week at this point. Of course, I also recommend getting texting put on your phone. Trust me, girls LOVE it, and it really does make things for us guys much more convenient too. I personally get about 100 texts a day usually. Much easier than messing with holding the phone while doing stuff, or staying on when you've got other stuff going on. Just shoot a text off in a minute and you're done with it till she texts back. And, as I said, girls LOVE it.

Anyway, I would have definitely kissed her the first night, especially since things were going SO well with her right then and there.

What you've said about your second night was pretty much perfect. Can't say anything there.

The points after that night where she didn't answer your call could be explained by a lot of things. Again, we can't always take a call, but a text just takes a minute to send off. So, texting IMO would have made all the difference in the world at this point. I'm betting she would have texted you, even though she didn't answer the phone.

Next, this girl and incident should NOT be affecting your self-confidence the way she is/did. It's just one girl. It's just one incident. Your first "point" wouldn't even make a difference if in fact she likes you. The second "point" shouldn't even enter your mind.

Now,

Quote :

so i paused for a second then said "are you really gonna call me back?"

. . . I don't care WHAT your tone of voice is . . . THAT line is NOT gonna come across NOT being needy.

Also, just because she didn't call you back even 30 minutes later, and you're worried about it (or were worried about it) is bad.

You need to step back from this girl a bit. The last time you were with her you did good. You pushed her away a bit and it drew her into you more, which MAKES SENSE. At this point, she honestly has no reason to be hooked on you though. So, give her some space, then if you haven't heard back from her in maybe a week, call her and invite her to hang out with you doing something fun.

I think tripp is right on his perspective, and from the looks of it, your in the same boat as I am, many of my recent FRs, some of the girls just dont answer my calls, or text. I worry about it sometimes, but the frame you hold for yourself is important, so Ive been thinking of programing certain responses to these things in my mind. On the other hand the girl, I met saturday goes to school full time and works full time, AND she is studying to be a doctor, so she doesnt need a needy man.
One thing I told her was when I went direct on her saturday night, I said, "U got a boyfriend" she says, "I dont have time for one" I said, "You havent met the right one" and got a smile. That smile I knew I had her caught, we made out and made out somemore when I took her home. I called her the next day, no answer.. texted her no answer. Same with a few other girls, either theyre busy or the passion from the night you met has died down. Its good that you did some kind of freeze out when you met up with her?

Ha, I actually read all the postings first......yes, I agree with Tripp as well. Everything Tripp said, I would absolutely give you the same advice.

And DTM, its just a girl......In your posting I saw some alpha characteristics, so keep up the good work!!

I agree with Tripp man. As someone over on mASF said one time and I'll never forget, "Neediness is never attractive!" and like Tripp said, that one line you said comes off as needy regardless of how you say it, even if you were screwing the crap out of some other girl while she was watching via video phone.

I know, that was harsh and I hope it is as good of a wake up as a bucket of ice water, cause I always wish someone had woken me up whenever I made mistakes that led down the wrong path and this is the wrong path. Take a step back, forget about her for a week or two, then if you still haven't heard from her you can give her a call if you still want and hang out then; making sure of course to get her hooked and go heavy on attraction, or it'll just keep going in the same direction it's been going. If it doesn't work, then ditch her and move on, you'll be happy you did, that type of girl is a pitfall for a PUA on the way up, a word from someone that's been there.

im going away to school in mid august. i dont have that much time. btw i know it sounded needy, so please stop reminding me

DTM wrote:

im going away to school in mid august. i dont have that much time. btw i know it sounded needy, so please stop reminding me

It happens man, don't feel bad about it, just try not to let it happen again. I know that sounds gruff, but that's exactly what I tell myself whenever I think of the needy things I did/do wrong, many of which far exceed the things pointed out in this thread.

So you're going to school in mid-August. SO WHAT??? That's not an excuse man.

This is how it works. You game OTHER girls AND Her at the same time. You DON'T NEED her. If she ends up liking you, you can her can continue to hook up while you're gone. If she doesn't, or if you realize she's not worth going further with (not as an excuse but she's truly not worth going further with), then fine, you two split ways. IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL MAN . . . YOU AREN'T MARRYING HER.

So you want to get laid now. I understand that. Guess what, it ain't gonna happen the way you are handling girls right now. You've got to progress things further.

The whole leaving in mid-August thing is a crutch for you right now. Get off of it and over it. Just live your life day to day right now, at this point, in this moment. Game girls. LOTS OF GIRLS. Trust me, when you start gaming LOTS of girls AND YOU HAVE CONFIDENCE in y ourself while doing so, you WILL start getting laid. Don't focus on one fucking girl.

I agree with Tripp , you needy bitch !

Noo, we all do / did that stuff.. Just take the feedback and keep in the back of your head. And you just learnt something + you had a nice experience with the girl( congratz ! ). If nothing would have gone wrong, you wouldn't have learnt anything.

I agree with all the advices above me. You're the man and you can care less about her. Push pull.

Cheers

V

And Carpe diem is one of the best life advices we can get. It's all we have. Today. The past is a ghost and the future doesn't exist.

The advice that uy gave you on another forum was bullshit.. if she isnt answering your calls.. who cares if she is gonna answer on another phone.. i woulda isolated and K closed her the first night and on the second night when her frined left with a guy, i would take her home or to her place or something.. btw, whenu clled on that other phoen, she lost ALL value for you. Honestly, you did fine, she was really iseasy and PSYCHO!!!! maybe she sint worthy of beign a gf, btu if she is hott, the way she trashed you.... next time you see her, bring a COMPETANT WING!!! isolate her.. and f-close, then dnt call her.. haha... evil.. i know.. but she toyed with you.. now its ur turn!!

RussianStar wrote:

The advice that uy gave you on another forum was bullshit.. if she isnt answering your calls.. who cares if she is gonna answer on another phone.. i woulda isolated and K closed her the first night and on the second night when her frined left with a guy, i would take her home or to her place or something.. btw, whenu clled on that other phoen, she lost ALL value for you. Honestly, you did fine, she was really iseasy and PSYCHO!!!! maybe she sint worthy of beign a gf, btu if she is hott, the way she trashed you.... next time you see her, bring a COMPETANT WING!!! isolate her.. and f-close, then dnt call her.. haha... evil.. i know.. but she toyed with you.. now its ur turn!!

Eh, 2 wrongs, dont make a right. He should just either freeze her out or move on...simple.

Paramour wrote:

RussianStar wrote:

The advice that uy gave you on another forum was bullshit.. if she isnt answering your calls.. who cares if she is gonna answer on another phone.. i woulda isolated and K closed her the first night and on the second night when her frined left with a guy, i would take her home or to her place or something.. btw, whenu clled on that other phoen, she lost ALL value for you. Honestly, you did fine, she was really iseasy and PSYCHO!!!! maybe she sint worthy of beign a gf, btu if she is hott, the way she trashed you.... next time you see her, bring a COMPETANT WING!!! isolate her.. and f-close, then dnt call her.. haha... evil.. i know.. but she toyed with you.. now its ur turn!!

Eh, 2 wrongs, dont make a right. He should just either freeze her out or move on...simple.

How is using her a wrong... its a 1 night stand, they both get what they need and part ways, thats as far as that goes.. its not wrong.. freeze outs work if the girl cares for you and just fucked up... if she dosent care either way, she will forget about you and thats that.

RussianStar wrote:

Paramour wrote:

RussianStar wrote:

The advice that uy gave you on another forum was bullshit.. if she isnt answering your calls.. who cares if she is gonna answer on another phone.. i woulda isolated and K closed her the first night and on the second night when her frined left with a guy, i would take her home or to her place or something.. btw, whenu clled on that other phoen, she lost ALL value for you. Honestly, you did fine, she was really iseasy and PSYCHO!!!! maybe she sint worthy of beign a gf, btu if she is hott, the way she trashed you.... next time you see her, bring a COMPETANT WING!!! isolate her.. and f-close, then dnt call her.. haha... evil.. i know.. but she toyed with you.. now its ur turn!!

Eh, 2 wrongs, dont make a right. He should just either freeze her out or move on...simple.

How is using her a wrong... its a 1 night stand, they both get what they need and part ways, thats as far as that goes.. its not wrong.. freeze outs work if the girl cares for you and just fucked up... if she dosent care either way, she will forget about you and thats that.

I didnt say it was wrong to use her, for starters. Reread what you wrote. Look, what Im saying is..is that you arent that girl, you dont know if she lost all respect for him. and if it is just a ONS, then who cares about respect..right? I mean don't you usually have no ties with someone or any bearing on the mind or heart if it is just and only physical? Plus, its only one fucking girl, sure its natural to want to fuck her, but i think there are others out there....last i checked....lol

k

wow forget it, i dont want any more badgering advice. and i DID try to k-close her the first night. apparently shes not the kind of girl that kisses the first day she meets someone. i texted her today and she replied, things are headed on a good path now. i dont need anymore help for this situation. thanks

AND im not out just to get laid. i could care less about sex right now to be honest

Badgering? Hmmm . . .

Good that you got texting. And she replied . . . hmmm . . . wonder who called that one . . . ?

i appreciate the advice, but i dont need a bunch of people telling me im "too needy". once is enough, i got the point

someone's angry. its ok...we aren't trying to make fun of you and pointing our fingers saying "your too needy, nananananana.." we arejust trying to help you, i mean, we all had fucked up situations and we jsut want to ake another guy happier with his life. Thats why we created this commmunity, we were sdick and tired of being played or not getting the girl we diserved

so i ordered her to come out and have a drink with me tonite. she agreed. i called her out on her flake-ness and i dont think she will ever flake on me again. i took her back to my place. definetly couldve gone all the way, but i live with my parents . what a game kill. she was all cuddly and stuff so i think she really likes me. we will see...


i did mess up once tho. she had her head on my lap, and she asked "so, what are you all about?" i went completely blank. i didnt know what to say. it takes me a little while to open up to people so they can see what im all about. what should i say in that situation?...being put on the spot like that.

GOOD JOB!!!

DTM wrote:

so i ordered her to come out and have a drink with me tonite. she agreed. i called her out on her flake-ness and i dont think she will ever flake on me again. i took her back to my place. definetly couldve gone all the way, but i live with my parents . what a game kill. she was all cuddly and stuff so i think she really likes me. we will see...


i did mess up once tho. she had her head on my lap, and she asked "so, what are you all about?" i went completely blank. i didnt know what to say. it takes me a little while to open up to people so they can see what im all about. what should i say in that situation?...being put on the spot like that.

I woulda chuckled and asked her what the hell she meant, cause that's a totally open question that you could fall into a lot of holes with if you miss-interpret it.

Rye Lee wrote:

DTM wrote:

so i ordered her to come out and have a drink with me tonite. she agreed. i called her out on her flake-ness and i dont think she will ever flake on me again. i took her back to my place. definetly couldve gone all the way, but i live with my parents . what a game kill. she was all cuddly and stuff so i think she really likes me. we will see...


i did mess up once tho. she had her head on my lap, and she asked "so, what are you all about?" i went completely blank. i didnt know what to say. it takes me a little while to open up to people so they can see what im all about. what should i say in that situation?...being put on the spot like that.

I woulda chuckled and asked her what the hell she meant, cause that's a totally open question that you could fall into a lot of holes with if you miss-interpret it.

Yeah, I agree with Rye here.

Also, living with your parents kills your sex? OMG dude, I've had sex with girls while living with my parents in the past and with the girls parents around too. Those situations are when the parents should be adult enough to realize you are an adult and have a life . . . and the kid/adult living with them should realize the same thing, lol.

well ive had quite a few chances to build up my frame since this. All have worked very well. I spent the whole day with her today (bowling, movie, tv, convos) and she had a great time. She had such a good time, that she wants me to have a "sleep over" with her some time this week. The best part is that her parents are out of town the whole week!

she has yet to flake on me, she answers the phone 80% of the time, and she promptly replies to my text messages. things are going good

DTM wrote:

well ive had quite a few chances to build up my frame since this. All have worked very well. I spent the whole day with her today (bowling, movie, tv, convos) and she had a great time. She had such a good time, that she wants me to have a "sleep over" with her some time this week. The best part is that her parents are out of town the whole week!

she has yet to flake on me, she answers the phone 80% of the time, and she promptly replies to my text messages. things are going good

Note . . . It's NOT AFC to jump on this offer. She already wants you to do it, so tell her you can in the next night or two. Do it soon and you may get a couple more nights out of it

Don't look at it as something uncommon. For instance, a girl I picked up last Wednesday has already been wanting me to spend some nights with her, so basically I have 3 different girls that want me to spend the night with them regularly.

well today (monday) is my only day off this week, so i told her that and she wants me to come over today. this chick likes all the same stuff i do, its awesome. ive never encountered this before

when she asked me to spend the night some time this week, i replied with "i dont know, i'd have to ask your parents first..." LOL u shouldve seen the look on her face. I got that idea from that bachlorette show clip Tripp posted