Strangers to the Game, or at least this forum . . .

WELCOME ALL OUR NEWBIES!!

I came to this board from another forum. Im still reading all I can but Im going out everyday and at least opening, Ive averaged about 2 closes in the past 2 weeks (daygame) and am still working 3 of those. Just got out of a serious LTR and want to have as much "fun" as I can for the foreseeable future. Im all about helping and getting helped, my problem seems to be being flaked on when it comes to a 2nd meet or "date". But if anyone wants to personally assist me or would like assistance, Im on AIM and Yahoo.

I've honestly been shocked as to the things I screwed up previously that I just didnt know about, in and out of relationships, and Im definately taking things seriously as the next time I do meet someone special, if I ever do, I dont want to screw it up. Or to even spend another weekend night alone when I dont want to. But in the meantime, Im still young, so its play time!

angryrocker4 wrote:

I came to this board from another forum. Im still reading all I can but Im going out everyday and at least opening, Ive averaged about 2 closes in the past 2 weeks (daygame) and am still working 3 of those. Just got out of a serious LTR and want to have as much "fun" as I can for the foreseeable future. Im all about helping and getting helped, my problem seems to be being flaked on when it comes to a 2nd meet or "date". But if anyone wants to personally assist me or would like assistance, Im on AIM and Yahoo.

I've honestly been shocked as to the things I screwed up previously that I just didnt know about, in and out of relationships, and Im definately taking things seriously as the next time I do meet someone special, if I ever do, I dont want to screw it up. Or to even spend another weekend night alone when I dont want to. But in the meantime, Im still young, so its play time!

Welcome to the forum man. Which other forum did you come from? Your closes that you've averaged . . . what type of closes are those? Number, kiss, or f? Getting flaked on the day two is a common issue, so we can help you resolve that. One key to remember right now is to be memorable. Where in KY are you from? I'm close to there myself.

I came from the pick up artist forum, I've gotten 2 numbers and two kiss closes in about 3 weeks total time of going out, one of the kisses was also a number. Im just focused on getting my butt out there right now, Im still in the "dont want to do shit" stage of a break up. Im plotting to go for a full close this weekend with one of them or someone new. Im in the Lexington area right now. Theres really not much here to work with.

angryrocker4 wrote:

I came from the pick up artist forum, I've gotten 2 numbers and two kiss closes in about 3 weeks total time of going out, one of the kisses was also a number. Im just focused on getting my butt out there right now, Im still in the "dont want to do shit" stage of a break up. Im plotting to go for a full close this weekend with one of them or someone new. Im in the Lexington area right now. Theres really not much here to work with.

Cool. Good to have you here, on our forum. Good progress that you've making so far. Honestly, it took me longer than that at first. Lexington area eh? That's too bad. I'm in Evansville. If you were closer I'd tell you to meet up with me and we'd go out on the weekend. If you travel up this way, let me know. We'll hit the clubs together. My city isn't huge, but there are some good women to work with usually.

yeah if I ever get out of this hell hole Ill definately take you up on that. I just realised that there was a good reason we didnt work, cant change it, just accept it, go ahead and get on with things and be happy I had her rather than not at all. Its hard as hell to do, but doin the hard stuff is my thing.

angryrocker4 wrote:

yeah if I ever get out of this hell hole Ill definately take you up on that. I just realised that there was a good reason we didnt work, cant change it, just accept it, go ahead and get on with things and be happy I had her rather than not at all. Its hard as hell to do, but doin the hard stuff is my thing.

Well, at least you've got your head pulled together at this point more than most guys would. Yeah, it's hard, but it's what you gotta do.

I've got a lot of friends that I hang out with in 3 different clubs here too, and usually have something going on with someone each night of the weekend, and at times have several groups coming together, with me as the common denominator, lol. I've got a few guys here that wing at times with me too, and of course we can wing each other as well when you get up this way. You should take a weekend and make it a trip. Plus, I've got girls in my social circles too, so you not only have social proof but also pre-selection too.

Damn dude, make a good offer why dont ya! lol. It'll be a bit, Im going through a job change and gotta get regular with everything, hell I'm even up to moving once I get the savings for it! I so hate KY anymore.

angryrocker4 wrote:

Damn dude, make a good offer why dont ya! lol. It'll be a bit, Im going through a job change and gotta get regular with everything, hell I'm even up to moving once I get the savings for it! I so hate KY anymore.

LOL, this is what comes from building things up I've got social groups formed from 2 different girls I used to see and one girl I currently see, plus a couple of other social groups that came as a result of finding the wings I hang with at times.

As far as hating KY . . . I couldn't agree with you more on that one. I've lived there myself previously and for FAR too long. HATE the f.cking state with a passion. Still have family there though, so I do have to visit it.

Hey everyone. I recently started reading "The Game" by Style, and despite my initial reaction, after reading through it a bit I can see that it's not some low-life thing to do. So, I'm in, my goal is to completely redefine myself. I have a lot of resources, so I'm going to read/watch them all, I think i'll be OK on that front. Going to start reading "The Venusian Arts" as soon as i finish The Game. What I'd like to ask you is, how soon can I start? What I mean is, what is the basic arsenal of information I need so that i can go out and get constructively rejected? Keeping in mind that I'm very new to this, so all I have is some of the lingo, and an intense willingness to learn. Now I'll go AFC on you and apologize for sounding so demanding.

Kam Leon wrote:

Hey everyone. I recently started reading "The Game" by Style, and despite my initial reaction, after reading through it a bit I can see that it's not some low-life thing to do. So, I'm in, my goal is to completely redefine myself. I have a lot of resources, so I'm going to read/watch them all, I think i'll be OK on that front. Going to start reading "The Venusian Arts" as soon as i finish The Game. What I'd like to ask you is, how soon can I start? What I mean is, what is the basic arsenal of information I need so that i can go out and get constructively rejected? Keeping in mind that I'm very new to this, so all I have is some of the lingo, and an intense willingness to learn. Now I'll go AFC on you and apologize for sounding so demanding.

Dont limit yourself to Mystery's material. There is a lot of other good stuff out there like Magic Bullets and some of David DeAngelos material.

What exactly do you need work on?
Give us some background info on your experiences, why did you join, etc Not all people who get involved are at the same level.

Welcome to the forum Kam Leon! Great to have you here.

As Meg said, don't limit yourself to Mystery's material, but you are starting off well. DO read the Venusian Arts Handbook. It will serve you well as a SOLID base for what you will learn afterward. Also, I'd personally recommend some of David Shade's material, especially "The Secrets of Female Sexuality".

And no, you're not being demanding, yet, lol. It's great that you're hungry.

Now, answer Meg's question, lol:

Meg wrote:

What exactly do you need work on?
Give us some background info on your experiences, why did you join, etc Not all people who get involved are at the same level.

Thanks for the advice, yeah I plan to learn from a lot of different guru's so i can have the necessary skills to put some stuff together. As for where I am now, well, hehe..

Lets see, I've never had a girlfriend (unless you count a 3 hour fling when i was 6, which ended after she spat on me), I'm not the most confident person in the world, so usually after starting a conversation it fades quickly to awkward silence, or else i make plenty of jokes and we end up being friends. From the "what kind of wussie are you?!" thread, i'd say I'm the "nice guy wussie".

I didn't primarily join so I can pick up girls, although that is part of it. I joined primarily so that I can change myself to be more like the kind of guy I've always wanted to be, confident, funny, etc

I'm a student of anthropology/biology at university. I probably have more female friends than guy friends, yet I still haven't had my first kiss.

Is that enough?

Well Kam it all starts with the confidence anyway. I mean, you should work on outer game at the same time as you work on inner game, and mesh the two up as you go along (it IS a process, after all), but the key to everything in the end is your inner game. As I always say, it starts in your mind. It's the mindset that you have for yourself.

Yeah, starting to learn that more and more. As I'm progressing along The Game (the book), I'm starting to see some of the problems associated with just focusing on outer game... Thanks for the tips, I'm still not sure how much of this I'm going to incorporate into my life, but when I am i'll be sure to get more active on this forum

If you have friends that are girls than you are not in bad shape. At least you are able to talk to females and gain comfort.

If you carry yourself and speak with confidence than girls will definitely pick up on it and the rest will follow.

~Meg~ wrote:

If you have friends that are girls than you are not in bad shape. At least you are able to talk to females and gain comfort.

Dear Meg, I couldn't disagree with you more. A guy who finds himself with more female than male friends is clearly on the internal circuit, the LJBFF list. Oh yeah, I added extra F. It sounds like it's not that he is able to talk to females, it's that females are able to talk to him. We men learn quickly that if a girl talks to us about the other guys she is fucking, she probably does not intend to ever add us to that list. Excuse the language, but I want that statement to be as blunt as possible because it's almost a universal truth.

Kam, there's good news and bad news. The good news is that you are definitely taking steps in the right direction, and you are absolutely correct to recognize the link between confidence and "game." You will develop game with females as an inseparable component to your development of confidence and security in who you are. And that doesn't mean you have to go wild and hit on every girl you know, but it does mean that as you develop yourself, people, male and female, will find you more interesting, inspiring, enjoyable, and attractive. What you do with it then is your choice.

The bad news is that since you're clearly on the perma-friend list with all of your girlfriends, you are going to have to distance yourself from them, at least to a degree. That doesn't mean you have to be rude or mean or anything like that. I am guessing you made that list because you're nice, considerate, thoughtful, etc. Now turn those efforts inward and focus on Kam. Constantly reexamine what in your life is really helping you and what is really hurting you. Rebalance accordingly.

Now, regarding your lack of confidence and its devastating effect on your conversations with women. You said you have no problem starting a conversation? Then it sounds like you are starting it on your terms, correct? Well, end it on your terms too. If you are at a party or something and you want to talk to somebody, give yourself a time constraint (this can be real or false, but it really doesn't matter; "I have to get back my friend in a sec" is just fine). You can start to build your confidence by just controlling this quick dialog, even if it is only a minute or two, or really even a sentence or two. "Hey, I was telling my friends that this party would be better if it was 80s themed, but they think it would be better if it was jungle themed. What do you think? Ah, you agree with me-- you must be at least sorta smart. Okay, gotta run, let's talk more another time."

But overall be careful limiting what you want to apply to your life. I am certainly not saying you need to read everything and apply everything to your life, but I am saying try to reduce everything you see to its basic elements. You'll find that so much boils down to confidence and presentation. Sound familiar? It's almost like... every single self improvement guide ever written. Except maybe The Secret, but this community doesn't emphasize magic so much... unless you subscribe to Mystery, haha.

Now post another topic with more specifics. And at some point in the next 24 hours, figure out why you have more female than male friends. Post about that too; no matter what, you don't want to be a perpetual outcast from your peer group.

Karma, All the while that your comment is only half true, I couldnt wholeheartedlly disagree or agree with your statement and Megs. Look, if guys would just look at us, ladies, as people and not something to cuddle up to whenever the mood strikes then there is no issue at hand. I am no feminist by any means, however the imposing thoughts of finding equality on this planet is very damn thin. Perhaps he is just as comfortable as hanging out with women and men. Some women have the same persona as men. IT IS POSSIBLE. My question to the guy is, are all your friends that are women run about the same personality? Do they carry themselves of the same psyche more or less of a man?

Personally I have more guy friends than girl friends. Is that a bad thing? If I want to hang out with guys and have a drink, do I see a problem? NO. I am versatile as a person to play the role of guy friend and girl friend because I view us the same. Now if only some guys on here, would view us the SAME, there would be less approach issues. Right?

I agree with all of you to a degree. When i was younger, one of my friends, who is gay but at the time didn't know it, always had a lot of female friends. I envied him, because i've always wanted to be part of that group, i just wanted to be friends with them. And now I am, in fact, a lot of my female friends are either lesbian or bi, actually i'd say its about 50/50 with lesbian or bi, and straight female friends. But the problem presented now is that, im not just looking for friendship anymore, I'm looking for more. I'm not necessarily looking to hook up with a girl for one night, but at the same time i don't see that as wrong, all people have these urges, be they male or female, and there's nothing wrong with that so long as you're not lying about it.

Developing confidence is key, I'm confident with people I know, I believe i have some good inner strength, but at the same time, i can be a pushover and i know it. So i'll take your suggestions, Karma, about opening a few sets and talking for just a little bit. I need to be more comfortable around strangers. Thanks again, this has helped!

I'm hoping to find some way to learn about the fundamentals of game and looking at them in a way that isn't so dehumanizing, at first i wanted to be the kind of person that could walk into a room and bend social dynamics so that he'd come out on top, now i just want to know how to bend myself so that i'd come out on top. I'll be doing a lot of research on this, i think every PUAG is getting to this at heart, from different perspectives (except maybe with the exception of speed seduction and hypnotism). If you know of any that have already taken this view, and you could point me in that direction, that would be very helpful! Thanks again

Paramour wrote:

ook, if guys would just look at us, ladies, as people and not something to cuddle up to whenever the mood strikes then there is no issue at hand.

I don't think it is such a binary issue. Personally, I love women. Well, most women. Of course I think of women as people. I respect and admire and cherish women, not just in some strange "giver of life" way but in a real, genuine way. If you have read any of my introspective vault posts, you'll know that I have absolutely adored the girlfriends I have had, and would move mountains to make them happy.

But that doesn't mean I want to be friends with them. I know it sounds like a contradiction but let's just drop the BS egalitarian feel-good idea of gender that has been pushed on us for so long. Come on, we're different! I wouldn't ever date a man, so I'm thankful that difference. If it's not biologically natural then it is at least culturally natural for us (and by us I mean every single culture I have ever encountered) to segregate on gender lines, and I'm just satisfied enough with at least that aspect not to want to rock that boat. It doesn't seem like it matters so much to some women, who find themselves friends with mainly men, but I'm telling you a grown man with a sex drive can't call the majority of his friends women and not have any stray thoughts. It's just not possible; testosterone ensures this. In fact, you should listen to act two of this episode of This American Life. It is about a woman who began taking massive testosterone injections in preparation for a sex change. Now complete, he describes the change in mindset regarding all things almost immediately after beginning the regimen.
http://www.thisamericanlife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?episode=220

Kam, are you sure your morals are square to your goals? You talk about being okay with one night stands and later chastise that as dehumanizing. It's hard for me to think of any of this as dehumanizing. If anything it's more humane than many activities. For example, you learn how to present yourself at work, how to get ahead, how to argue, etc. These are all skills learned for selfish interest. For me, I like to spend the majority of my time with a girl focusing on her needs and desires. Rather than acting simply for my own benefit I am really trying to please someone else too. It is probably the only situation where I really care about another human being's instant well being. So... dehumanizing? I disagree with that.

~Meg~ wrote:

If you have friends that are girls than you are not in bad shape. At least you are able to talk to females and gain comfort.

If you carry yourself and speak with confidence than girls will definitely pick up on it and the rest will follow.

I actually really agree with this, at least the way it's coming across to me. Kam, you seem to have at least this advantage going for you, that you can create comfort in the girls that are around you. The problem I see is that you're not building attraction in any of them.

I also agree that ONS's and SNL's are ok, as long as both parties know that's what's going on, going into the encounter and are both OK with it, otherwise it's one party using the other, and that's not OK.

As far as dehumanizing this . . . I think that's the one BIG problem with a lot of guys that get into this community. Too many ARE looking at girls as strictly pieces of meat to satisfy their primal urges, when in fact girls most definitely DO have value, and that should be recognized. So, Karma, I agree with you on that and actually on most of your points as well.

Par has a point that may help Kam, I'm not sure. I don't know, maybe Kam is already doing this, looking at women and men equally. Maybe that's why he can so easily create more friendships in girls. Of course, Kam, you already have no problem creating comfort, so that really isn't an issue anyway, it's creating the attraction that is the issue for you.

As far as walking into a room and bending the social dynamics so that you come out on top . . . that's one thing that I actually teach in various ways with the advice I dish out, and it's also what Mystery teaches as well, if you pay close attention to what he's saying. In fact, it's what most PUG's teach, deep down under the surface, but not all of them are effective with it.

However, if you were to watch Mystery in action, usually he pulls off what he teaches very well. He can, in fact, walk into a venue and become the center of attention, the life of the party, and draw people to him. It's also what I do in my venues. So, yes, we are bending the social dynamics in our favor and coming out on top.

rAfc here. I found this forum through google looking for PUAs to learn from in my area while I'm home from R&R from Iraq. I've been studying pickup for a little while now but haven't gotten to/ got the nerve up to try to apply it yet.

Welcome man.

We've got a good member from Texas. Fortunehooks1 is his name. Look for him here on this forum.

Well, I'm Ritch (not rich lol.) I'm currently in Iraq but from Portland, OR. Living in Texas. It's confusing, I know. I just ordered Mystery's book, as well as "The Game." I go on leave in a month so I will get to try what I am reading about out in Portland. Only for a couple of weeks before coming back to Iraq. I want to learn each and every thing there is to know. In other words, I am ultra determined. Thank you for letting me be a part of the tight, well learned, and dam right bad ass community.

Ritch, very much welcome to this forum. We have tons of great info here and a great core group of guys to get insight from.

I'm sure you can learn everything you're looking for to complete your journey here.