You all are my board of advisors on this situation (long)

I'm coming to each one of you for your input on a sticky situation I have at the moment. There is one detail I won't give out publicly, but that detail tells me I can't completely cut this girl out of my life, which is what I should do at this point, at least in my opinion. That is how I would normally operate. Vault members know this detail.

Now, for the record and to state this publicly (my current feeble attempt at humor, lol). . . I'm not perfect either and don't know all the answers and am only human, hence my confusion in this situation.

I will use letters to refer to most people in this situation, to keep full names hidden while attempting to limit confusion as well.

For the past 4 months (met her on May 3rd) I've been seeing this one girl, we'll call her K. Things have been very deep and serious between us. She told me she let me into her life more than she has any other guy since her husband. Ex now of course. That was about 4 years ago. Things were so serious that, one night in the past couple of weeks at the club, there was a joke about a guy proposing to his g/f on stage. I made the remark that I could do a LOT of things at a club, but proposing was something I just would NOT do at a club. She looked at me in my eyes and said "you better not". Now, if you catch the undertones there, you see that things were indeed serious.

I'd been spending a couple of nights a week at her house as well. I'd been seeing her 5 and 6 days a week, along with everything else I've been doing. Now some of you see why I'VE been so busy, lol.

Anyway, like any other couple we have had our rough patches. Most of which obviously blow over.

However, two weeks into our budding relationship we had almost hit a breaking point. She realized how fast and hard she was falling for me and got scared. She turned a girls night out into a date with another guy. She was trying to pull herself away from me. She ended up at the same club I was at. I saw the two. Of course she blew me off for him that night. I tried to talk to her about it, to see what was going on, and she shut me down. I didn't talk to her the next day. She contacted me the next night, telling me basically the pain was too much. She was missing me and couldn't stand not talking to me, not hearing from me that morning, etc. I agreed to meet with her and talk, to see if there really WAS anything there to pursue. We met the next night and patched things up. At this point, I made a post about it and Fortune commented that for me to give her a second chance in this situation which was outlined then, she had to have been an amazing girl, have a great package for me to stick with her. He was right. At that point, she was an amazing girl. She had to be for me to gloss over the shit from that night. Anyway, I told her when we talked that if she ever did anything like that again, it would be over between us. She said ok.

Now, that's the background that's relevant to something that happened this past Friday.

K used to complain if she didn't hear from me very often throughout a day. If I was extremely busy on a particular day or something, she'd complain because I wasn't giving her any attention. Understandable. So I'd do my best to make up for it. She loved hearing from me in the mornings, at night, seeing me at night, and if she was working and I didn't text, she thought I was mad or for some reason making myself distant from her. Basically, she was scared I was getting rid of her, if I wasn't just mad about something, and if I was mad, she wanted to know why, like any good significant other would.

So, if I couldn't call, at least she wanted me to text, so she could communicate with me. Hence, we would text a lot. She loved it.

Now, enter into the picture a friend of mine we'll call L. This is a girl that I met at the club and would play around with in a friendly way. She gave me social proof and pre-selection and I had no romantic or sexual interest whatsoever in her, but we would play around and flirt a bit. We had fun together. That was the whole point. She was a loner. I gave her some fun, she gave me what I needed as well.

I introduced K and L. I introduced K to all of my friends. She was that important to me. Things were cool at first. But I started noticing that whenever we were at the club, me and K, and L was there, if I tried to talk to K, L would stick her head in, literally, to disrupt us. She would also start talking to K to get her attention away from me. If K and I were talking, it wouldn't last longer than a few minutes before L was trying to disrupt us. It started getting very annoying.

At one point, one night, when i hadn't seen K much and we both wanted to spend some time together and have some fun at the club, L literally told K to tell me to go off somewhere for a minute so she could talk to her. Well, K told me this. She was going along with L. It pissed me off, but I took off. I started gaming other girls immediately and ended up dancing with one within minutes on the dance floor. The girl was having a blast with me . . . through a couple of songs, so there was a good 10 minutes in there. Throughout this time, K never texted, never came to look for me or anything. I glanced over and she was still with L. I started dancing with the new girl through another song. Still nothing from K. At this point I tell the girl I have to get back to my friends. She doesn't want me to go, but says OK. I walk back to K, who then says "I was just about to text you." Yeah, right. She's standing there with L, still, and has another guy talking to her.

Another day K starts bitching at me about texting. I'm thinking this is strange coming from her. She's complaining about texting me "all the damn time" and she can't be doing it and things like that. I'm thinking . . . very strange. I bring it up to her. I ask her why the change. She then comes out and tells me that L has been texting her constantly, and she's texting her back, while at the same time she's not texting or talking to me. She's L's new best friend.

Now, this stuff is building, and building. And not in a good way obviously. I see it happening, but there's nothing I can do about it.

So, at this point, K is talking to L about things, then wonders why later I don't know anything that's going on with her.

It comes to a head Friday. L comes by K's house, asks her if she wants to hang out with her that day. K says ok. So, they spend the whole afternoon together, while K barely talks to me. I text her that afternoon and ask her why she's so quiet and distant. She tells me she's been with L all afternoon. Now, here's another change. Normally she would tell me what's going on with her if she wasn't able to talk to me much, so I'd know. A courtesy. Well, now she just doesn't care. She didn't let me know, and we start arguing.

Alright, she texts me that night saying she has a babysitter so WE can go out. Cool. She texts me and tells me when she's leaving her house. Cool. I'm also on my way to the club. Well, I walk in . . . and see L hovering over K. K turns and looks at me, does the little wave with her hand to say hi, when normally she would smile and reach her arm out to hold me, then kiss me because she misses me. Not so this time. L is hovering over her and that's apparently what counts. I go up to her anyway. K is at the bar getting her drink, as she usually does when she first walks in. She gets it, turns from the bar . . . and L is following right with her.

Enter the DJ's girl, we'll call her A. A comes by and says hi to me and hugs me and I tell her about a group of girls outside the club that I just number closed. We part, I start to walk with K. L is still hovering. I'm thinking . . . I thought this was supposed to be me and K, not me L and K.

Alright, I'm VERY annoyed at this point. I tell K I'm going to do say hi to the DJ or something, I don't remember exactly. K stays with L. I'm VERY VERY annoyed now. K can't leave L's side tonight. She's choosing L over me, when she said she got a babysitter so WE could be together. At this point I either texted or walked back up to her to tell her I want to talk to her privately. She says "not with that attitude."

Needless to say at this point I'm VERY pissed off. Here L starts talking to security. K grabs my arm and tells me to calm the fuck down if I don't want to get kicked out . . . of MY club. Then she goes right back . . . to L.

I go to the DJ and talk to him a bit to calm down. From the DJ booth we see a sea of hot girls. He's pointing out all the hot girls I have available to me. As he says I should go out there and clean house. However, obviously, my state of mind isn't the best at the moment.

K texts me and says she's on the dance floor. Right at this point, I'm by the dance floor so I start looking for her. I don't see her. I text her and tell her to come to me. She says "fine." She never comes. I text her and ask her where the hell she is. Turns out L took off real quick, away from the dance floor, and took K with her. K texts "between you and L, you guys are killing me." Ahem, I thought this was supposed to be mine and K's night out? Yeah, right. Not as long as L is around apparently.

Later I see K and L on the dance floor again, and K has a guy dancing with her. She knows I'm there, and she starts getting into the dancing with this other guy. I think about cutting in, but figure fuck it. As long as L is around it's pointless to. How do I know this for sure? Because of everything that has been happening, plus another incident that happens right after this dance. The guy leaves K, L walks off the dance floor, right by me. K walks right up to me, stands in my face, and asks if I'm going to watch her all night. I tell her I'm not here to watch her, but to spend time with her. Well, L realizes that K is talking to me, comes back, grabs K and starts pulling her away. I reach out my hand to stop K. L hits me to knock me away and pulls K with her. K goes with L.

Later K finds a nerdier looking guy, dances with him, keeps dancing with him, then her, L, and the guy go to a table and sit down and start talking.

Alright, throughout the night, I'm not standing or sitting around stalking them. In fact, the whole time I'm talking to other guys and girls that are friends of mine. We're laughing with each other, girls are kinoing me, guys are talking about other girls we're seeing on and off the dance floor, who they would fuck, etc. I have girls coming right up to me in front of these guys and opening me, and K, L, and mystery guy are sitting at a table nearby watching all of this. Of course they say that I'm just watching them all night.

Alright, I'm feeling unusually drained, so I go and sit at a table. Alone. I want to be alone right now. I'm scanning the club as I usually do from time to time to update myself on what's going on. I see that those three are still sitting at the table, but suddenly K and L start scanning the club because they look at where I WAS standing . . . and I'm not there. So, obviously they want to know where I am . . . to apparently keep up this show K is putting on for me. L gets up and literally starts looking around the club for me. She finds me, (I realize this later when I turn around and she's back behind me . . . WATCHING me), starts texting K to tell her and her stand in b/f where I am. I'm ready for this night to be over at this point, but am hanging around till the club closes to say bye to the DJ and A. So, I'm sitting by myself, checking the time on my phone, lowering my head, wanting to sleep, lol, and once I realize that L is behind me, watching me, I check out K. She's got her face close to Mr. stand in, as in body language talk of kiss me. They remain this close, and he has his arm around her, blah blah blah. Eventually K and L get up and leave the club. The guy walks around, sees me, (apparently she had told him what I was wearing or what I look like or something), and he turns tail and walks away.

This scenario is really hilarious, because at one point through this night, K actually texted me and told me to quit acting like a child. Then, what happens . . . her and L act like children.

After the club closes, I go to the DJ and A. A asks me the status. I tell her it's done with me and K. She says basically to calm down because "girls lose their way at times." I said "yeah, she lost her way tonight and I'm saying fuck her."

The next night, last night, A tells me that she initiated texting that day with K, basically just long enough to tell K to not talk to her for a couple of days.

K is a member of this forum, but rarely checks it. However, since I haven't talked to her since Friday night, she was on here this morning at some point. BTW, her and L were out again last night.

In my opinion, K has pulled this shit on me twice of blowing me off in the same manner. However, this time it was worse because it was supposed to be mine and her night. From my perspective, she can't get her head out of L's ass long enough to see day light anymore.

I told her last time she blew me off that if she ever did it again, it would be over.

Now, fire away people.

It seems your too busy trying to be a player to actually have a real relationship. Even in this rant, you try to DHV yourself constantly to come off as a player instead of just being concerned about the relationship. Most high value girls aren't going to stick around waiting for a serious relationship while your out gaming other girls-- especially if they aren't allowed to do the same, as the story suggests. The only way most girls would tolerate that treatment is if you had some kind of hold over her, like being her first love or first sexual partner.

That's my view at least.

I have an accordance with Hobbit's input.

However, you know there is a synapsis in a woman's head that says "RUN". We do it for reasons of which we can't explain right there at that exact moment. It's a gut feeling we get. In your situation, she is probably relying on other judgement til "the waiting period" is over. If you might say. Sometimes, a girl needs a friend like L because she knows the course of the relationship and it's state isn't "concrete" if you might say.

The churning in a woman's head to KNOW for a fact of the unknown can deprivate us into thinking beyond even reality and feel remorse and such. Which is why we act upon emotional grounds because we have to learn to "survive" with or without!

Does that make sense to you?

At this point Tripp, you gotta turn the PUA badge off, because if infact this is an LTR you would like keeping, then pursue it by all means, the fact of the matter you have to ask yourself these questions.

1. Is it gonna make me happy to have her back.
2. Are you ready to deal with what shes giving you

I mostly tell my friends that, if you choose to remain in a relationship with the girl, then you deserve to deal with the bs. Totally this is bs, but I wouldnt deal with the situation as you had. You mentioned that they were looking for you in the club, I guess they had to be doing a jealousy plotline on you and it worked. Ive never been in this situation before, but i want to be, just to see how I would calibrate the situation.

Tripp stop take a deep breath.......Ok now think about what you wrote man,to me I think it sounds like your having a little one-itis over K.You may not see it but brother its there..Ok really if it wasn't bugging you man you wouln't have waisted the engery to text her and ask her why she was doing what she was doing.I know I am not gifted in this area because hell I couldn't keep my wife around..But after learning this skill of PUA I have noticed things about the way people act,talk,and type..I will say this Tripp you like the girl yes,but if she is playing games like she is obviously doing.then cut your ties with her and L and move on and don't give it another thought..You waisted away in wonder about K and when really you should have put Tripp first.Now giving the fact that you did have feelings for her still the signs were mounting up for you,you gave her a choice and to me it sounded like a threat witch isn't cool.But none the less it is history now..I think you should just cutt all ties and just face the facts its over,and she is bringing the old AFC back out of you and getting you all down and showing your weekness's.Don't let her get the best of you man,your one hell of a smart man Tripp you really are..Seriously tho lets look at what K and L did all night.They obviously were out to have fun with your feelings and it worked you posted a thread about it for one..I am not saying thats bad or anything but really it kinda is..Tripp you say you wasn't watching them but really you was man,you told us pretty much everything they were doing all night.As for them watching you and seeing where you were they was still wanting to fuck with you more and it worked..Man if you was down as much as you said you were then really why did you stay man?I meen the DJ and A would have understood if you wouldn't have stayed to say goodnight,you didn't game anyone to keep you occupied your head was in K and L's hand and they were treating you as a puppet.You should have sucked in your pride and just went at as if "it wasn't a big deal"because it is not a big deal..Sure you were developing feelings for her but you kept letting it get to you and bringing your frame farther and farther down and we both know brother thats not good.So what I am saying to you is you should have just left and called it a night and forgot about everything that had happend and said your goodbyes and left..I wish you the best man and I hope this doesn't get you down anymore than it already has..I hate seeing you like this Tripp because man its just depressing seeing a man of your caliber become a AFC again..I could be wrong for calling you that or suggesting thats what it made you out to be but that is how I read the story.Man just take a deep breath and write down a list of 10 things you like about K and 10 things you do not like and I bet you that you will see there more things you don't like about her then you do...But regardless of what has happened Tripp I am hear for you as a friend brother,If I am able to help at all don't hezitate Tripp,because I know you would do the same for me and you have done the same for me,you opened my damn eyes in my post "my inner game"....So my hand is out there for you if you ever need a friend Tripp...I hope my ramble made sence and if it did I hope you think about what I said...So get back to the Ole wise one and our Feerless Leader lol......

Jamie V.

Thanks for all of your response. Here's one that was made by another member that was deleted. I won't say who the member was, but I think the comment has a lot of merit as well, because this is how I see things myself:

"Obviously L is a bad bad influence. She is pulling shit behind the scenes for whatever reason. Maybe she likes you, maybe she likes the control, or maybe she enjoys drama. I think if you can separate those two you will get the real K. It would be nice to have a 1-on-1 convo without L's presence to get to the bottom of all this.

However, at this point I think it would be best to cut her loose. The more chances you give the more she is going to play silly games."

It's funny that there are some here who say I'm not giving enough to her, and just being a player, and some who say I'm giving her too much of myself because of the shit she's throwing at me.

In truth, yes, I miss her. That's to be expected. Yes, I do love her, and in fact, the last text I sent her that night said "I actually love you." She never responded to that, but instead put the display of the jealousy plotline on for me at that point, even stronger than before. So, is that someone I should still mess around with?

Yes, Jamie, I do have one-itis for her. She's the one girl out of all of the pick ups that I struggle to get out of my head. I do miss her and I do love her, but can I put up with this shit from her? When she says it's "our night" and then won't leave L's side to talk to me privately? Hence the problem. As long as L's around, I can't have a private convo with K, which is what is needed, badly.

Hobbit, I appreciate your post and would like for you to clarify for me. How was I being a player? Jamie noticed how I was actually down that night from all that shit. Does it make me a player because I was laughing with other guys and giving them tips on how to attract the girls they were looking at? Does it make me a player because I had girls coming up to me, talking to me, and opening me, and hugging me? I wasn't going around at that point looking for my next pick up. As was pointed out, I actually had my mind on K. I wanted her. I wanted to be with her. However, with L around, I couldn't be. Please tell me, from your viewpoint, how I can care more about a relationship when the person I'm in the relationship with makes it a point to shun me to stay with someone else? I mean, I specifically said to her, more than once, to her face and through text to just talk to me privately so that we could get this shit cleared up. What did she do? She chose to stay with L instead of talking to me. Tell me Hobbit, how could I change that outcome? Also, should I just stick with her and be a silent partner throughout the night so that she can give her attention to L? When it's supposed to be her and me being together that night?

Yes, I did watch them while there at the club. Of course, it's kind of hard not to when they keep turning up by me, wherever I am. No, I was not running around the club looking for them. Sure I glanced at them several times when I was talking to other people, when they were right nearby. Sure I watched as she danced with the first guy I saw her dance with. I thought about breaking in, as I said, but didn't figure it would do any good. As I said, I wanted to spend time with her myself. I had missed her all day. Again, repeated requests on my part for her to talk to me privately to get it all cleared up were met by resistance from her, and for her to flirt with other guys.

So, from that viewpoint, she wanted to get rid of me.

Which is the point Par is alluding to, however, the core issue of where Par is coming from is not entirely true. Par, you say she needs a friend like L. A friend that causes strife and drama with her significant other. Nice friend to have.

Alright, feel free to give more input to clarify these questions.

K doesnt see it right now. She will eventually. She is relying on L(for the time being) because L apparently is listening to her every word. K needs that. She is getting it from her. You can't be snappy, when someone isn't there to be at your command and lose grasp on it. She wants time and needs it to think. Yea, im pretty sure she has a million things going through her mind and is trying to straighten her own head before she comes to you. You need to quit about the L thing, thats the engine for disaster. Let K come to you. The tighter you grasp water, the easier it slips through your fingers!

Tripp, man, dont be hasty in your decision. Clear your head first. Think of the logistics before you do anything.

FYI, when i said K needed a friend like L, i meant just that...not that it was good or bad. Im saying, L knows yours and K's situation, yes i think she is feeding off the drama, but only perhaps K gave her initiative. I'm only suggesting time constraints. Take a breath!

And only you can decide, is she worth the risk?

Paramour wrote:

K doesnt see it right now. She will eventually. She is relying on L(for the time being) because L apparently is listening to her every word. K needs that. She is getting it from her. You can't be snappy, when someone isn't there to be at your command and lose grasp on it. She wants time and needs it to think. Yea, im pretty sure she has a million things going through her mind and is trying to straighten her own head before she comes to you. You need to quit about the L thing, thats the engine for disaster. Let K come to you. The tighter you grasp water, the easier it slips through your fingers!

Tripp, man, dont be hasty in your decision. Clear your head first. Think of the logistics before you do anything.

FYI, when i said K needed a friend like L, i meant just that...not that it was good or bad. Im saying, L knows yours and K's situation, yes i think she is feeding off the drama, but only perhaps K gave her initiative. I'm only suggesting time constraints. Take a breath!

And only you can decide, is she worth the risk?

First, L DOESN'T know the detail that's in the Vault. At least, she didn't know about this Friday, when all this happened.

Second, I am taking a breathe, and a break. I haven't talked to her since Friday night.

Last, what does K not see right now but will eventually.

This situation is really hard to gain insight since I don't know except whats written. But look at these examples:

Quote :

It pissed me off, but I took off. I started gaming other girls immediately and ended up dancing with one within minutes on the dance floor. The girl was having a blast with me . . . through a couple of songs, so there was a good 10 minutes in there. Throughout this time, K never texted, never came to look for me or anything. I glanced over and she was still with L. I started dancing with the new girl through another song. Still nothing from K. At this point I tell the girl I have to get back to my friends. She doesn't want me to go, but says OK. I walk back to K, who then says "I was just about to text you." Yeah, right. She's standing there with L, still, and has another guy talking to her.

You gamed other girls out of spite and went dancing. But you got mad when she did the same.

Quote :

A comes by and says hi to me and hugs me and I tell her about a group of girls outside the club that I just number closed.

It was suppose to be yalls night, but your already closing other girls before you get in the club. I'm sure things like this happen frequently, which was the basis for my comments.

Going by L's and K's can get confusing when reading. But I do know relationships take work and not getting so mad when they don't behave how you expect. There is always two sides to the story. I understand the dilemma with a friend but you can talk about that, tell her how you feel. Instead of writing some post in the hopes she'll read it, since your not talking. Like I said, its hard to give advice given that the situation is more detailed than I know.


And this isn't one-itis. It'd be one-itis if they broke up and he was still having troubles months or years later. People are allowed to feel...

First, that is the problem. You want TRUE advice from your members, then the WHOLE story should be put out there. People might give the wrong advice and it could be damaging. YOu know this.

Second, before I write anything else. Let me get this straight. You and K are together. YOU introduce L to K. Why did you do this? Why did you feel that it was necessary?

And if L STILL doesn't know about the KEY thats in the Vault, then I wouldn't question K. However, its likely that K did relay the message to L and she using that info to occupy her time. Either that or L is a very needy person in general and that it may not have anything to do with you.

More input can clarify.

I need you to tell me more about L, before you introduced her to K. That would help!

Quote :

Yes, I do love her, and in fact, the last text I sent her that night said "I actually love you."

Sounds like you already know that you care about her deeply, and its obvious that her hugging up on other guys affected you. Since you feel this way about her and you believe that she feels the same it sounds like you need to get her alone to talk to her. I know you weren't able to at the club because of "L" but you need to get one on one with K. I think you guys have a good relationship together and you want to continue it. As Juice mentioned you need to turn off the PUA badge a bit and just talk to her when you can.

You were in the club "L" messed things up and that does suck. As Paramour mentioned it's obvious that K feels like she can go to "L" and talk to her about things going on. She is confiding in her right now because she is having a hard time talking to you. I'm not sure why she isn't but that is something that needs to be sorted out pronto.

While you were in the club because of everything happening you tried to work a few girls perhaps for a jealousy plotline. She knows you too well for this to be really effective. As you know this works pretty well the first few times you go out. She did it back to you and it got to you some, and why shouldn't it you care about her. She cares about you too or she wouldn't have been looking around the venue for you.

It stinks that you haven't spoken since Friday. I hope that you are able to get in touch with her very soon to sit and talk about everything. If you want things to work out with her, which it sounds like you do, then you are going to have to go to her and open up to her. You need to really make an effort to speak with her about all this. The primary reason she has "L" around is to talk to her about it, because she needs an outside opinion. I know that it sucks and it complicates a lot of things but you can't really help who she's friends with. You'll just have to deal with it as things happen with "L." What is the backstory on "L" anyways? How does she know you? That would help figure things out a bit more.

I would also very much consider consulting "A" to see what she thinks about the situation. As Hobbit said there are two sides to every story. I know that "A" is in your social circle and probably has a very good idea of what is going on. Since she is your friend I would talk to her to get a female insider perspective on this. It might give you some extra insight that may be very helpful to you.

GOOD LUCK IN THIS

im sorry i cant input on this situation. anything i would say would be from my imagination. i can say that i do wish you the best of luck. i would stick through this. through thick and thin times.
its times like these that you need friends and guidence. i hope you achieve what you need.

OK, Hobbit the point you are referring to didn't happen this past Friday night. Sorry if it sounded that way. That incident was before this past Friday.

No, I did NOT post this on the forum HOPING she would read it. In fact, I specifically posted it AFTER she had looked at the forum. She most likely did look to see if I HAD posted anything about this. Which I hadn't at that point. So, no, that wasn't the reason I did this. I did it for the reason I stated, I want input from others.

Normally, actually, it's not a big deal to me if she's dancing with other guys. In fact, I've TOLD her to dance with other guys before. THIS night it WAS a big deal because I wanted to spend time with her . . . and L was hovering over her, as she has been lately. This night K was shunning me . . . then dancing with other guys, so of course that would bother me.

Yes, you guys are right. She's not a one-itis, she's been an LTR. There is a difference, this is true.

And, as far as me her talking about how I feel, that was why I was trying to talk to her that night. Again, she refused to talk, choosing to stay with L.

Par wrote:

First, that is the problem. You want TRUE advice from your members, then the WHOLE story should be put out there. People might give the wrong advice and it could be damaging. YOu know this.

Second, before I write anything else. Let me get this straight. You and K are together. YOU introduce L to K. Why did you do this? Why did you feel that it was necessary?

And if L STILL doesn't know about the KEY thats in the Vault, then I wouldn't question K. However, its likely that K did relay the message to L and she using that info to occupy her time. Either that or L is a very needy person in general and that it may not have anything to do with you.

More input can clarify.

I need you to tell me more about L, before you introduced her to K. That would help!

Yes, I realize the whole thing about giving damaging advice. However, some things don't need to be completely public knowledge either. Especially when someone that's such an interference into the whole situation doesn't even know herself.

I introduced K to L because at the time L was a friend of MINE. I introduce K to all of my friends. Why shouldn't I? That's how much I care about her. L was always a loner . . . at that time. She's not now because she's inseperable with K.

Yes, it's likely that L is more needy than I realized at first. However, that should not keep K from talking to me, or spending needed time with me. That's in K's court.

BTW, I met L in this same club. She was actually acquaintences with a couple of guys I know there. All are single people. Well, L isn't single anymore. Days before this whole mess happened she found a b/f. The b/f wasn't with her this past Friday night. I've met the b/f and he's a cool guy.

Yes J, obviously I do care about her deeply. In fact, I just sent her a text saying "we need to talk . . . privately". It's up to her where to take that.

I still think "L" is a bad influence. Yes, I do think "K" needs a girl to confide in thats why she has turned to "L", but at the same time L could be feeding off this need. People who are loners tend to grasp on whoever befriends them. They will even isolate that person from other friends. I have seen it happen. However, I dont know the girl so its hard to say for sure if she is causing the drama or merely following.

As a few others have pointed out I can see how Tripp's "being a player" might effect things. She might think that the way you treat her is the way you treat EVERY girl. Therefore maybe she is acting that way because she is incredibly confused. Its obvious that she is trying to get some kind of reaction from you. If she does think (as I have described above) it could be a test to see how much you cared.

As Par said give the girl some time to think about things. Then sit down and discuss your relationship.

Aahh, the isolation from friends. I hadn't put it together in my mind in those words, but that fits.

Of course I'm biased, being in the middle of this, but I don't believe L is merely following the drama. I believe more is being caused by her recent actions. I do say recent because she didn't SEEM to be this way at first. I will give her the benefit of the doubt on that.

Well, K and I did talk tonight about our relationship. Some things were discussed. More issues will obviously continue to be brought out into the open in the coming days.

L.A. Tripp wrote:

Of course I'm biased, being in the middle of this, but I don't believe L is merely following the drama. I believe more is being caused by her recent actions. I do say recent because she didn't SEEM to be this way at first. I will give her the benefit of the doubt on that.

Mr. negativity rears his ugly head once again. Look from all angles. Listen to what me and Meg are telling you, better yet, understand it. You can't ONLY pick the negative parts of the stuation. All aspects will help you see clearer if you choose to see it.

I know what you're going to say. You don't have to. It's something I recently picked up on to our own detriment. Turn off your PUA skills and throw away your "pride".

Perhaps you should "talk" with L. Kindly.

Glad to see you gotto talk to K.

Paramour wrote:

L.A. Tripp wrote:

Of course I'm biased, being in the middle of this, but I don't believe L is merely following the drama. I believe more is being caused by her recent actions. I do say recent because she didn't SEEM to be this way at first. I will give her the benefit of the doubt on that.

Mr. negativity rears his ugly head once again. Look from all angles. Listen to what me and Meg are telling you, better yet, understand it. You can't ONLY pick the negative parts of the stuation. All aspects will help you see clearer if you choose to see it.

I know what you're going to say. You don't have to. It's something I recently picked up on to our own detriment. Turn off your PUA skills and throw away your "pride".

Perhaps you should "talk" with L. Kindly.

Glad to see you gotto talk to K.

Ahem . . . are you missing what I'm saying? I'm looking from all possible angles at the moment. Did I not say above I was giving her the benefit of the doubt on this one? However, my talking with L at this time just isn't happening. I've explained that elsewhere. I've also explained how my goal is not to shut her out, but talking to her right now just ain't happening.

You can't say I'm wrong because I'm calling what I see.

Meg has mentioned one aspect of this that no one else saw, and I think she has a great point with it. It makes sense. Since you're wanting to say I'm not looking at all angles, have you considered that point? The behavior displayed Friday and in at least one other instance fits right into what Meg pointed out.

Hi Tripp.

In my opinion everybody makes good input here.

First of all I'd like to say I'd agree with Meg concerning L. A loner. She is lonely and K gives her the social proof, the talks, the not being alone.

And for what she gives to K? K might be confused about your relation. Here you have to find out why ! Maybe she sees you as a player if that's a subject ever brought up in your relation. I have to agree with Hobbit on this part. If you're in a relation and you have a date at the club, you shouldn't #-close girls outside the club if you're happy in your relation, which I think you were . Maybe that's why K is confused, maybe not..
Anyhow : K gets confused, L gives her the chit chat, "clearing up her mind".

But of course, since L is a loner and her purpose is to have some social girl where she can attach herself to, she won't clear up her mind. She'll say things that will detoriate your relation. So she can have L for her. A friend. She doesn't care about the relation you 2 have.

So , things need to get handled. And I wouldn't wait till L manipulated her mind.

I wouldn't try to break the 2 up, like para said, leave them some time alone. If you try to break 'em up, L will use that vs you !

BUT what is not good either is to act like you not care. Concerning the confusion K deals with, that might actually proof that you don't think she's that important( and I think you do find her important ! ). And your text message was sweet but I don't think you're already there.

You need to talk with her mate. Don't talk bad stuff about L! In fact, don't make L darker, but make yourself brighter. You know how to handle that I think.

And I'd also agree with Hobbit about this is not a one-itis but normal feelings. People fall in love you now. You already were quite some time together.

Anyways, this is the input of your 21 y/o Belgian friend

Cheers,

V

Thanks V. Yes, she is important. Actually, I did talk to her last night, and more today. Some things did get brought out into the open. Some things that needed to be cleared up. Me and her both made mistakes that night. We did talk through some of those last night. After Friday night we both tried to put up an impenetrable wall against the other person. Apparently that didn't work. So, here we are regretting how the weekend went, and moving on.

However, the L factor is still a huge issue to deal with. At least at this point.

L is the negative catalyst in this equation, and to compromise with her still being apart of K's life is huge LA. It shows that you are comfortable even when someone opposes your relationship. Here's my passe comment, Why the downturn on L's part toward you? Could it be that she has harbored a disdain for you for sometime, and K is the vehicle that she's using. Forgive me for going Pysch, but I think there's some underlining motivation on L's part. In my view she's upset with her own life, and she has a level of disgust about the way your life is operated. The swinger lifestyle vs. traditional lifestyle, that's the point of argument that L, to me is operating from. Good news to read that K has opened her mind and decided that she needs to communicate with you, and leave L in isolation for a literal sec. peace,lvoe and succe SS

Fortunehooks1 wrote:

L is the negative catalyst in this equation, and to compromise with her still being apart of K's life is huge LA. It shows that you are comfortable even when someone opposes your relationship. Here's my passe comment, Why the downturn on L's part toward you? Could it be that she has harbored a disdain for you for sometime, and K is the vehicle that she's using. Forgive me for going Pysch, but I think there's some underlining motivation on L's part. In my view she's upset with her own life, and she has a level of disgust about the way your life is operated. The swinger lifestyle vs. traditional lifestyle, that's the point of argument that L, to me is operating from. Good news to read that K has opened her mind and decided that she needs to communicate with you, and leave L in isolation for a literal sec. peace,lvoe and succe SS

Fortune, it seems you've teamed with Meg and struck another point that hadn't been brought out. I have no problem with you going pysch on this matter, because you are bringing something else out that wasn't seen before. I need more thought on this, lol.

I have talked to K again tonight. There are obviously still rough patches, which is to be expected. Of course, it's up to both of us to iron those out, which is a work in progress. We, in fact, even brought up a point about L tonight that is a hindrance, but it was brought into the open, which is a good thing.

Thank all of you for your input up to this point. It has revealed things I didn't see before.